Your Family Constitution with Natalie Elisha Goldberg

george grombacher 0:02
went for this George G. And the time is right welcome today’s guests strung apart from Natalie, Alicia Goldberg. Natalie, are you ready to do this?

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 0:08
I’m ready. So you’re George G. I’m natty G. Is that like it’s the G club right now? George,

george grombacher 0:14
I think I think that this is absolutely the inaugural meeting of the G club. Thank you for coming. I’m excited to have you on Natalie.

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 0:22
I think we should like talk to Gary Vee and be like, we should do the bng club. I think there was a good vibe around that.

george grombacher 0:28
Yeah, I think that there’s definitely something there to explore. So Natalie is a wealth business and asset protection attorney, she’s helping her clients protect their lives so they can live their legacies. Natalie, tell us a little about your personal lives more about your work, why you do what you do.

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 0:46
So I wanted to be a lawyer since I was always but really, it’s so solidified. 15 years old, why I’m walking across the street and two guys are racing their cars from light to light. One hits me a fifth at 60 miles an hour I 15 years old pedestrian to survive that he didn’t even touch a brake is a miracle beyond miracles, okay? All of a sudden, I’m like, my whole life is different. And in a wheelchair, and thinking like why me? Thank God within a month and a half and out of that chair dancing back on stage and just an incredible recovery. But it solidified in me that I wants to bring justice to the world. And I thought that was going to be like being the Perry Mason asked attorney fighting in court. And and the truth is that once you’ve gotten to court already, you’ve lost, win, lose or draw because the amount of money times stress that you’ve put upon yourself to get there is astronomical. Instead, what if we actually gave people the language around money, family love and relationships, what everyone deals with, so that they could live a better life. And I like to call that wills trusts and estates because there’s really no better way to address it. But really, it’s family harmony and continuity by addressing the big elephant in the room, which is money and money issues. So that’s why I do amazing

george grombacher 2:28
that they catch the people that hit you with the

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 2:30
car. So Supposedly he did come back, I was obviously unconscious, the guy left a block away from me where I grew up, he never said I’m sorry, and that my deposition, where I’m crying my eyes out. In fact, even the court reporter is crying her eyes out, everyone at the table was just, you know, weeping. telling my story he looked at didn’t even look at me stone cold. And you know, and that’s the humanity that clearly like he was briefed by his attorneys, you know, but we’re human beings. And I think anyone that approaches their work, or the law or anything like that is missing it. Like, the whole reason we are here is to experience other people and an escalate our life and elevate ourselves that sometimes we make mistakes. But you know, that’s his spiritual journey. And mine is very different. And mine is about elevating the world. I like it.

george grombacher 3:34
All right. So giving language around money, family, life relationships, and the legal equivalent is our wills, trusts and estates, with the purpose being family harmony and continuity. So I think I know what family is, what what do you mean when you say harmony,

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 3:54
so we don’t want the kids to kill each other where mom and dad die because they’re fighting over the money. And we don’t want people who have started families together to kill each other, getting divorce and having the kids then live in this limbo world. We want that even when sometimes relationships don’t work out, we can be civil, we can be fair, and we can be just with one another. So that’s what I’m talking about what I’m talking about harmony, right? Being able to live with and define for yourself, the Constitution you’re gonna live in. So here’s the thing, George, you know, with trust most people think a trust they think of like the trust fund bro right at your favorite Ivy League university. What they don’t realize is the trust is the greatest legal gift given to the people which is why all the very wealthy have them. Imagine a scenario where the average Joe can also have that because he or she can Then define and control how their life’s work perpetuates into future generations. I mean, really, it’s just about do you want to abide by the government’s laws and rules? Or do you want to create for yourself what you believe should be your family manifesto? That’s all.

george grombacher 5:22
Is anybody ever said, the government’s plan is what I want?

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 5:26
Yeah, they’re full of shit. Because George, what’s the government’s plan? That that’s the next question, right? What is the plan? If you know the law, so well tell me what’s the plan? So there’s no answer, they just want to be defiant, which is fine. But I mean, if you’re gonna throw down with a girl from Queens be ready. So we, we come directly back at you, and we’re gonna make you justify what is that law that that you’re abiding by? And if you don’t know the answer, then clearly you have no idea what you’re talking about?

george grombacher 6:05
Well, I think that that certainly, I asked him, I’m sure people give you all kinds of different responses. So that’s, that’s not surprising. But when we do use the slow thinking part of our brand, and you think about that, yeah, yes, yes, clearly, I would prefer to be able to define that on my terms. And I certainly see the wisdom in doing this upfront, even though it might be a pain in the neck. And it’s kind of uncomfortable things to be talking about, to experience that small amount of pain now versus the risk of my family getting torn apart, either when I’m gone, or because my spouse and I divorced, and it’s messy than to

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 6:45
Georgia doesn’t have to be uncomfortable. You know, I think a lot of attorneys are doing it wrong, quite frankly, they’ll call George, come in with your wife. Make a list of every asset you’ve ever had. Bring in the Megilah sit with us for two hours. And we’re going to talk this to death. excuse the pun. No, it has to be simple. It has to be like bumbling bow, stay in control the things that you care about, keep it private, no court, no outside party interference, boom, done. Everyone wants that. And by the way, if they don’t want that, like I don’t want to be next to them because they’re like, something is wrong, right, because we all want to have things easier, better and less money in our lives. And I think that what lawyers traditionally have done is they’ve made it super expensive, because they want and they want to use the legalese so that they can justify charging big rates. And we’re turning that on our head George, I’ve done the law firm thing for 10 years built my own law firm. Thank goodness and all Libi TV, legal commentaries, TED talks all of it. Now I’m like, How do I get to the heart of the matter, which is bring it to the masses so that everybody can have it. And it’s really by minimizing the cost and maximizing the efficiency and the language around it, so everyone can understand what the heck this special contract called trust does?

george grombacher 8:16
Well, I certainly appreciate that. It sounds a lot like my industry, where it’s this illusion of complexity and, and an illusion of skill, frankly, but charging a lot of money and using a lot of jargon in order to to sort of justify that. So I appreciate that very much. Is there a is there. Are there people that don’t need to worry about this? Is this something everybody should worry about? Who is who is that a great candidate?

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 8:42
If you don’t care about what happens when you’re gone? And you have been fine? Don’t? Okay, like that’s up to you. If you care, though, and if you’ve lived a life on purpose, and you’re leaving something bigger than yourself behind or want to, then that’s the person right. And George, it’s more than just, I mean, okay, well, in a trust is a one time thing you’ll do, hopefully, you don’t have to change it that much. Because life doesn’t change that much that the people you’ve listed, I hope outlive you, etc. Really, it’s about how do you live your life? Like are you living and default or by design? And that’s really what it comes down to. If you’re ready to sit in the driver’s seat and say, I am a co creator in this life and I get to decide, then you live a certain way. And if you don’t, that’s cool, too. But that’s not really who rafter that’s who I call the walking dead right?

george grombacher 9:43
Yes, there are many of us who are just carried along by the current not paying super close attention and just sort of going through the motions. And that’s a pretty lousy thing. And I feel bad for those kinds of people. So that’s not who we’re talking about. And I can’t imagine there’s anybody like that who’s listening to the show for six months.

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 9:59
Or do you only attract the best and brightest?

george grombacher 10:04
So, I love the term manifesto. And I spent a lot of time thinking about values and living intentionally and living by value. So everything you’re talking about is music to my ears. Let’s tell me more about a family manifesto.

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 10:24
I did not truly understand what happens when you start a family. So I think, George, it’s a real paradox in this country, especially that we are basically telling women to be men to work like men, to achieve like men, etc. And by the way, we’re kicking ass at it. Like every law school, every medical school, every women are the majority now. And yet, many of these women are choosing not to have children. And if they do have children, they cannot win. Because the conversation is when you’re going back to work, or Oh, you have to go back to work or, Oh, you’re not going back to work, or what do you have this great education for? And we do not really value motherhood in this country. Unfortunately, we say we do. But there’s no village there. This rugged, individualistic enterprise, which America is based on is a tough place to be when you have newborn children, and figuring out who am I now. And who’s the person that you take anything out on the nose, it’s the person closest to you, because that’s your safe place. Without a written set of terms and values. We can lose ourselves. And I think the zero to five year age range of children is probably the hardest time for most new families. Because we don’t talk about anything. And in fact, I was on Good Morning America, very pregnant with my second child, they came to my apartment in New York City. My husband and I are sitting there with our first daughter. And we’re talking about a concept I speak about, about in my first book, The millennials guide to the universe called a baby prenup. Lo and behold, who gets a hold of this Good Morning America clip Trevor Noah and puts it out there and makes fun of us as we baby prenup the latest in white people child rearing, he says, and it’s hysterical. And I’m very thankful because you can’t by press that good. And he’s a man who has no children. No idea what I am talking about. And the fact is that if you don’t have a clear, defined ecosystem with your spouse, who’s doing the dishes, who’s cleaning the bump, the bump bumps, who’s taking out the garbage? How much? How much are our grandparents allowed over? And which set of grandparents and if your mom is saying something not nice to me, what do we do to that to solve that? And to mediate that? And nobody talks about this, George? Nobody? And then we wonder, why does it why are people like dropping like birds right out of this marriage race or choosing not to entertain them and beginning because we just are so utterly scared of having these very real conversations, and no one has ever taught us. But I promise you, if from the time we’re in high school, college, graduate school, we’re constantly taught marriage constitution. What are the rules and responsibilities replacing? Let’s have this conversation. What’s the baby prenup? Once the kid comes? How can we really address issues we may not have seen because you can pretend to know what it’s like to be a parent. But until you’re a parent, you don’t know anything. As you note with a three and six year old at home, true. So this is all part and parcel to saving the family unit because I believe that through it we can experience all of life’s joys and as a result leave the world a little better than me that you found it. I love all of that.

george grombacher 14:36
I love the baby prenup. I love the family constitution, the marriage constitution and I certainly know how important expectations are. In every anytime there’s human beings involved we we are better served by talking about expectations as much as we can up front. George as

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 14:56
you know, you don’t know what you don’t know So how could you possibly unless someone is literally your guide, guiding you through this in advance, you’re just trying to survive and keep another human being alive, right, which, like, we’re not taught how to do, no matter how smart you are, no matter how many degrees it’s never been, like here is the sleep schedule on here is how you kind of are like, law, you know, up a creek without a paddle, and you’re figuring it out as you go. And there was a lot of really depressed and and quite frankly, shocked women. When this one motherhood happens, they I don’t think we’re ready for the shock of what it is to lose yourself and become an us instead of an eye. And a lot of friends, a lot of clients, colleagues, we talk about this in private. And I think it’s about time we started talking about in public because this is the real pandemic.

Wow, totally agree. And

george grombacher 16:21
it sounds like we’ve got some more episodes to do together, Natalie to time pack a lot of these because I like talking about being carried along. And just because women are now doing something completely different. And the role has completely shifted shifted doesn’t mean that that’s the right thing or the wrong thing. It’s just the current way that the river is sort of flowing. And unless you do the work and have the conversations and think the thoughts, is this what I want, is this what I think the correct way to live my life is Is this what I want for my family? Well, then, you know, you’re it’s not going to be optimal.

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 17:03
George, I, my highest performing post of this new year, was one this week on LinkedIn, talking about laundry and dishes. And people came in like, Yes, I’m with you all the way to, obviously higher health, which is like done, we hire how, and thank God, we can do that. And, and and by the way, many cleaning services don’t do dishes and laundry. And it’s this Annette like, unspoken about thing, where I can’t tell you how many very successful people, women especially I know, who say my husband just leaves his shit everywhere. And it’s up to me. And it’s a lot because they’re also like CEOs, executives, partners at law firms, you know, medical doctors or dealing with their life, making sure that their children are okay. And on top of it. Kind of raising their husband to and that’s a lot. Yeah,

george grombacher 18:14
probably not very sustainable.

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 18:17
For all the men listening, do your own dish.

george grombacher 18:22
Real grow up people. Alright, so So when somebody engages with you? And is, these are some of the conversations that that that that you’ll have, or that you’ll help them to have?

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 18:38
Yeah. And you know, George, what we’re looking to do right now is shift the business model. It’s been a traditional law firm for many years, for about a decade. We’re working right now on a product that will allow people to answer simplified questions, to build around trust for a fraction of the cost. With the thought that then there will be retreats, group sessions available to also talk about things beyond the law, right? And to dive kind of deeper into this family constitution thought this baby prenup thought, now, is it a piece of paper that you’re gonna take to court say, you were supposed to change the diapers and you didn’t? And we’re gonna know what it’s just an ethos, right? The principles by which a family believes they should live by that are amendable at any time.

george grombacher 19:30
Stories mean to go, Natalie.

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 19:33
I’m sorry, George. I didn’t hear you start as you mean to go. Yeah. You know, we can only start from where we’re at. We don’t know what we don’t know. And there’s a big learning curve. And I really believe when people are walking down the aisle, for the most part, they’re doing it for the right reasons. And I think our society is just really not mastered The new wave of what women are like today and how you’ve achieved. And I heard this once. And I really resonated with it, that we did a great job educating our young girls to believe that they could be and do anything. We didn’t do a great job educating our young boys about how to handle women who believe that and have done that. And I think this is the incongruency that we currently are living with. And I think we can save it. I think we can save families, and not and, and I’m sure and, you know, couples where there’s two men or two women, they go through similar things, because it’s the unexpected the the expectations that have never been spoken about. So it’s just about better communication.

george grombacher 20:53
Yep, that makes a lot of sense to me. I love all of it. We got one crack at this deal. So the more clear we can communicate with one another and be thoughtful and intentional. And I can throw lots of other terms in there, the better. And just like with personal finance and money, and doing the dishes and the laundry, and who’s going to be responsible for this, these aren’t necessarily the easiest conversations, but they can be to your point doesn’t need to be like going to the dentist and getting teeth pulled so. So I’m super grateful for your work.

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 21:32
Thank you so much. And if I could ask you, but with your work? Are you seeing that the conversations around money are happening with both members of the family? Or is it generally with one who takes the lead?

george grombacher 21:46
Yeah, that’s always been the sort of the traditional thing is that, you know, one is a saver and one is a spender. And sometimes that may be the way that it is. But I spent a good amount of time working with people on how to have this money conversations, how to talk to your partner, your significant other about money. Because while we’re never going to be on the same page, we need to get as close as possible. And please be engaging in the conversation and removing any mystery. So.

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 22:17
So that leads me to a great opportunity to say, well, if they want to talk about money, well, they can just look at my new TED Talk. We just had to have the money talk to increase your bless. Thanks for that lay up there, George. There it is.

george grombacher 22:31
I love it. Well, Natalie, thank you so much for coming on. Where can people learn more about you? How can they engage? And certainly where can they where can people find the TED Talk?

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 22:42
So the TED talk is on YouTube, just do a search now Alicia Goldberg of how to have the money talk. And please find me on LinkedIn. I’m very active there. We just had Georgia and I connected anything I can do to help anybody speak and communicate their truth in a way that matters for them and their families. It would be my great privilege.

george grombacher 23:04
Excellent. Well, if you enjoyed as much as I did, show, Natalie your appreciation and share today’s show with a friend who also appreciates good ideas. Find Natalie’s LinkedIn talk, how to have the money talk. And it was actually at my alma mater, Alma Mater, Valparaiso University on YouTube, and I’ll link that in the notes and find her on LinkedIn and all other places. Natalie Alicia Goldberg. I will link in the notes of the show as well. Thanks. Good, Natalie.

Natalie Elisha Goldberg 23:30
Thanks George stagey all the time.

george grombacher 23:35
Sure, and until next time, remember, do your part by doing your best