The Future of Coliving with Grant Shipman

Grant Shipman 0:15
Hey George. Thanks so much. This is a cool honor to be here. This is great. Now that’s excited. I’m excited to have you on tell us a little about your personal life, more about your work and why you do what you do. Yeah, I so it’s, it’s like, as connected as you say it is. I, I always wanted to be, be, you know, find my find my soulmate, be a dad, all of that stuff. And, you know, before the show, like we were talking about, I’ve got, you know, two little toddlers. Now,

george grombacher 0:02
Grant. Shipment is the founder of living Smith. It’s an organization specializing in CO living, property management, investment strategies and innovative solutions to our housing crisis. Welcome to the show grant.

Grant Shipman 0:45
we just found out we’re pregnant a couple days ago, so I’m probably not supposed to say that, but might not get back to my friends and family, so we’ll find out. But the this, I really wanted this and in, oh, man, when I, when I first was doing business, I I owned an acrobatic studio down in Austin. It was wildly successful, but I had no time, and so I made that mistake of reading Rich Dad, Poor Dad, which was fantastic. And I thought, I don’t just want, like the dream Bay, magical journey. That’s what I called it, right? My soulmate, find my girls. But I want the I want the schedule and the finances to be able to enjoy them. So, man, about what’s been like 10 years now, I stumbled across what has become to known as CO living. But it’s a, it’s a, it’s a new rental real estate strategy and and, holy moly, it it took me to financial freedom in 15 months. I was two months later, I met my my the who would become my wife. Her name’s Sarah. And, you know, we got pregnant on our honeymoon, and we got pregnant right after that baby. And things just keep getting better and better and, and by the way, I just, not only does it provide financial freedom, this CO living, real estate investing, but I just am a community freak. I love it. I love seeing these non traditional households, these just, you know, normal, mainstream people, like, like any of us are, except for now, they have a household to be part of, right? So, so that’s kind of where I’m at now, is I’ve got my my family, I’m enjoying, you know, sharing about what I do so other people can do it. And really, it’s just a it’s just great to have that freedom of schedule and and to watch, kind of watch real estate happen, except for specifically with households and making a difference, not not merely providing, you know, safe, good housing.

george grombacher 2:50
Well, I appreciate all that. What an advertisement for Rich Dad, Poor Dad, right there. You made the decision that you wanted to change your entire life. You read that book, and it all worked.

Grant Shipman 3:00
Yeah. When I, when I read it, I, you know, I made my number. How much money do I need? And passive income to to have, you know, financial freedom. And I was like, That will only take me 10 years. I was like, oh, but, but, well, also 10 years, you know, if I don’t goof up and everything goes right, but, but I’m telling you like the even back then, when I thought it was going to take me 10 years before I discovered co living, I thought this is 100% worth it. I just doubled down and went after

george grombacher 3:33
it nice. And I love the idea of creating households over simply providing housing. I think that that’s cool. I’m a big community guy also. So what? What is CO living? Is it dormitories? Is it apartments? Is it?

Grant Shipman 3:50
Yeah, it so. So I think something that makes it hard to understand, and this is why your question is so important. I’m really glad you asked, because it is, it shares similarities out there, like, I say, co living. And some people think, you know, like student housing, like you mentioned, dormitories. Or some people think, you know, sober living, or or rent by the room, like, as far as like more housing for low income, this kind of thing. But specifically, co living is part of the share economy. You know, it got going really strong back in 2010 It started around 2003 but it’s mainstream people who who would like to live with others. They don’t want to sign a lease with strangers. They want to live in a neighborhood house, just a normal house and and they like, they like to live with others. So what co housing is very, very specifically, is you find a normal Neighborhood House and you put a lease on each bedroom. It’s a long term lease. Because most people stay. Our average tenancy is a little over two years, and and people just kind of have community on their own terms. They enjoy a nice house that’s easy to keep clean because there’s multiple responsible adults keeping it clean and and, quite frankly, it is the only immediate solution to the housing inventory issues that we have right now. It’s, it’s quite fantastic.

george grombacher 5:27
So I was reading on your website that there have been a couple of pretty large companies common to to, to name one that received, like, $100 million of investment and then promptly failed because of tenant issues, I believe, yes. So how do you you mentioned mainstream people, so I appreciate that you probably have a really good streak screening process and selection process. But how do you overcome the challenges that these other companies fail to overcome? So,

Grant Shipman 5:58
George, like the this really cool thing. I call it the $256 million question, because not only did, like you mentioned that that common 100 and $12 million startup fail just went bankrupt in June of this year. And, and, but, but plenty of other companies have Star City Ali, in fact, all of the companies, the large startup companies, have failed, 250, $6 million worth, except for one, and I don’t know it just it was, I don’t know if it’s had enough time to fail yet, but, but why? Yeah, yeah, I really hope it doesn’t. I really hope it doesn’t, but it does come down to this question of, how do you find people that get along and and this is why, this is where, when I read Rich Dad, Poor Dad, where I landed on, like, holy cow, this accidental hit part of my history is going to make me so much money this. So what I had happened was I had a some tough things happen in my life, and and I did the unexpected, and I moved in with hippies. I moved into a housing Co Op. I was, I loved it, by the way, it was a vegetarian kitchen. I’m not a vegetarian, right? Like it was. I mean, so many things that I wasn’t but that they totally accepted me. They thought this was great. I thought this was great. I had those tough things in my life. I discovered kind of this, the joys of the they’re called the intentional living community, right? Housing, co ops, communes, all of this stuff. They’re people who don’t live together because they have to, but because they want to. And but the downside of the intentional living community, if there is one, is that it’s not for mainstream people, right, like and so I accidentally found my way in there, and I thought, Wouldn’t this be cool if it could be offered for mainstream people? So, so what I found out from them, and how to answer this 250, $6 million question, is you don’t need to find the right people. In fact, the right people move in together all the time, right friends who have been friends for years, etc, and they get in all kinds of fights. What they what I learned from them, and you know, they’ve been doing this for not just decades, but centuries. Is what you want, is the right kind of household. So when you have a healthy way to live together, then anybody who’s reasonable and responsible will thrive in that environment. They don’t need a particular you know, like temperament or job or affinity or things like that. So really, how we do it? We actually have a pretty straight it’s a the screening process is just like anybody in rental real estate, right? There’s an application. We check references, we do a background check, they sign a lease, they move in and and it works out really, really well. So, so as far as how, how are we succeeding when all of these people, with not just a lot of money behind these companies, these have proven leadership, big time software, but when it comes down to it, people are just people, and they need a healthy environment to live in, you know? They need structure, but not too much that kind of thing.

george grombacher 9:26
So there’s got to be some secret sauce, though, or

Grant Shipman 9:31
no, yeah, let me, you know what I some people tell me. They’re like, Grant like, when you’re not thinking about your answer, you tell a story, and it’s so much more helpful than your answer. So So I guess a little, you know, little gut punch to me, but maybe a story is best. So I’m going to, I’m going to change some names, but early on, when I got started, there was a guy named John living in the house and and he. Contacted the property management company, and he said he was living with the devil. The devil’s name is Tim, and said all kinds of awful things about Tim. And, and anyway, the the property management company said, hey, you know that’s, you know that’s your your that’s in your household. Just use your conflict resolution system. And and then, and then Tim, unbeknownst to John, had contact the property management company said he also was living with the devil. And the devil’s name was John, and and, and, I mean, how many times has this happened before? Right? I heard one preacher say that at one point, most married people think they’ve married the Antichrist, right? Like, and if they, if they stay married long enough to figure, you know, to to have that realization, and, and it’s just a matter of, of, well, let me get back to the story, right? Because that’s the point. So John and Tim, that was on, let’s see, that was on Friday. And, you know, we kept, we kept hearing it from both of them. Just kept saying, use the resolution system this, you know, then on Tuesday, do you know what happened?

george grombacher 11:17
Something bad,

Grant Shipman 11:20
right? What? Oh, well, they went to Taco Tuesday. They walked to Taco Tuesday. And they have done that every single Tuesday, as far as I know since then, and that was in 2018 they are best friends. Do you? Do you? Do you want to hear? Do you want to hear the the the inside, like saucy scoop of what happened between them? Of course, I have no clue. I have no clue. And here’s the and this is the reason is, is like con so they figured it out themselves, and conflict is such an important part of building a trusting relationship. So people in your household, whether they’re your relatives or not, you’re going to step on each other’s toes. When this happens, you build a mutual respect and appreciation. It doesn’t matter how much a a healthy household hangs out. They don’t have to be BFFs. They don’t have to get together, you know, for three hours a week, and soon sing Kumbaya. But, but there for this trusting relationship to happen, conflict happens. They have to handle it. If somebody else solves it. Doesn’t work, they handle it, and then they build that trust, and not only does it build like a really great household, but more importantly, each of us, personally, if we’re in that place when we solve a conflict on our own, when we didn’t see a way out, it’s very empowering. So to say, what is the secret sauce? Is we give them a conflict resolution system that you know, the hippies you know, perfected over the years. It’s a little 10 minute conversation and then we just butt out because it’s none of our business.

george grombacher 13:11
So the screening process, it demands people are emotionally intelligent, to recognize when they’re having an issue, and then to be empathetic enough to recognize that other people are going through stuff also, and we’re adults, so we need to have a conversation about this, person to person,

Grant Shipman 13:28
yeah, yeah. And, and, actually, I mean, a lot of us are there or might be there, but when things get tough and somebody says, hey, we need to talk. The only rule in the house, it’s part of the household agreements. The household covenant is people in the house have said, if somebody says, you know, can we have, can we talk? And then that’s a 10 minute conversation. And, and you need to make time for that, you know, either then or in the next five, six days, and, and so if somebody doesn’t have the emotional intelligence to notice things like this, then they’re going to get it in the house, or they’re going to self select out. I mean that that happens all the time in life. 100%

george grombacher 14:14
Alright, so you, you’re, you’re clients are people who are interested in becoming investors. Your clients are individuals interested in in joining a household? Yeah,

Grant Shipman 14:27
the the main client. So, so in in regard to clients, as far as renters or clients, as far as current or interested investors, to say, renters, this is a massive demand. We have waiting lists. We don’t need to advertise in any unique way. We use typical advertising. So that’s not needed. What’s needed, and this is really the reason why, putting myself out there this year is we’ve been training people since 2019 But, but what? What really needs to happen is this kind of housing only independent investors, you know, can provide, right? These big money startups, they’re trying to solve it with software. There’s there’s government, you know, there they don’t do a great job of providing housing. So for people who are current or want to get into real estate investing, you can provide this type of housing. I bought all my first houses with not a dime of my own. And you know, a house is going to pull in. You know, if you pull in like man, $6,300 a month, and it would normally pull in maybe 25 as a as a rental. So to say, this is a really powerful income strategy. So yeah, if there’s investors, I would love for them to learn about this, to get interested in it and provide the housing. Because, holy cow, I mean, investors make way more money for way less, and renters get a big, beautiful house for the price of a room. It’s like a massive win, win,

george grombacher 16:02
it sounds like it. So you are providing the, the framework, the blueprint, for somebody who says, this is interesting. Where do I even get started? And you’ll take them from soup to nuts,

Grant Shipman 16:16
yeah, yeah. Um. So I kind of, I put a, I put a goodie bag together for anybody listening George like this, this, I thought, Okay, this for people who are really interested. This is not, you know, listed anywhere else on our website, but on if you go to livingsmith Pro com, forward slash, life blood, there’s a goodie bag there. So one, there’s a book that our renters wrote, and it is awesome. People love it. So that’s normally like, $28 thing on Amazon. They can download that with code. The other thing is, we have a free five day training coming up and and we will give you everything, even if you you don’t have money, you don’t have real estate experience. I was, I was I was driving, I was delivering Domino’s Pizza in a shitty Prius, and renting a room. When I got started, right? The lender laughed at me. I had no savings, right? So, so this five, this five day training, if this is peaking anybody’s interest, this is a great way to do it. And if there’s somebody who really just wants to jump on it, do those two things. And you can schedule a call with me or one of my team. We do a 30 minute consult, and we’ll go over things with you and really get down to it. That’s a one on one consult. So, so yeah, it’s livingsmith, pro.com forward slash, life blood, and that’s just for anybody who’s listening here, because I want to do whatever I can to get behind that. We need to duplicate efforts. This kind of housing is so in demand,

george grombacher 17:49
and I think it makes a lot of sense. So I definitely appreciate it. Is there a profile? You are obviously an exceptional person. You’re driving a Prius and delivered pizzas, and I need to do something. You’re already an entrepreneur because you had the acrobatics.

Grant Shipman 18:11
Yeah, yeah, I was, I was a struggling entrepreneur, you know, trading the 40 hour week for the 90 hour week. But yes, right?

george grombacher 18:20
Is there. So just the profile of people who are interested in this. Let’s dig a little bit more into that. Obviously, it’d be better if somebody had a bunch of cash. But you’re saying it’s not necessarily necessary. What about, what about just how interest rate environments have changed, or just the whole, just the housing market in general.

Grant Shipman 18:44
Yeah. Well, this the, I mean, if you run the stats, 150 years and longer, has always been a good time to buy real estate. Now, it’s never a good time to buy real estate if it’s a bad deal, but all the properties I’ve ever gotten are off the MLS. But to say, when I got started, I was like, oh, like, this dawned on me. I was like, holy cow, this can make so much money. So I just texted all my friends, and I said, Hey, you know, if you give me, if you want to partner with me on this, I’ll do all the work. You bring in 30,000 bucks, and we’ll get you 1500 a month and cash flow, just, just everything, even after the mortgage, all of that stuff. So I, I had people say, Are are you a realtor? I’m like, no, like, Are you a mortgage lender? I’m like, No, I have zero real estate experience. I was just like, you know, just, just told them, hey, this is, this is where I’m at. But I know, I know how to do this if you’re willing to take the chance. And so the first gal who took the chance with me, she was a long time friend, her first house so she was making 2000 a month. That’s after she split it with me, because we are making the house was cash flowing 4000 a month after three. Months, she had enough money to buy another house, and six months later, another house. So she had three houses for the price of one that were cash flowing. I mean, I mean, I don’t know how much people have expectations for their their a normal house to cash flow, but the goal is $200 or more in these houses where we’re cash flowing like $2,000 you know, even, even split between her and I so, so just to say that, as far as the profile of a person, I would say somebody who’s open to learning new things, if you want to do it the old way, it’s not going to work. And and then somebody who has a good, good character, right? Like if, if people trust you for a reason, because you’re a trustworthy person, this is going to be something easy to do, whether you have money or not

george grombacher 20:54
nice. And the reason that a cash flow so much more is because if we have a four bedroom home, we have four individual leases, theoretically speaking. And people who are doing this are paying a bit of a premium. If that’s the right term,

Grant Shipman 21:13
yeah, it’s, I mean, you sell pizza by the slice, it makes a whole bunch more money, right? And, and people love it, right? Yeah,

george grombacher 21:25
yeah. That is a that is an awesome that is an awesome analogy, right there. So I,

Grant Shipman 21:32
I’ve got to give credit to the the right, because I’m always saying things in stutter stories. The general manager of pad split, which is the current company. It’s a $30 million startup that hasn’t gone bankrupt yet. They just became profitable. I hope that they do well. But the the general manager of pad split and I are friends is named Quentin. But he’s like, Grant, stop being so confusing. Just say it’s selling pizza by the slice. And I’m like, Oh, you’re a genius, Quentin. So props to him, man. I’ll yeah,

george grombacher 22:04
that’s pretty funny, right there. I love it. Nice. Well, Grant, thank you so much for coming on. It’s been fun to talk with you and to learn about CO living. Give us the website again. How can we get the goodie bag? How can we take advantage of that free five day training?

Grant Shipman 22:20
Yeah, go to livingsmith pro.com so it’s livingsmith pro.com forward slash, life blood. If you remember that, just jump on there. Get a hold of me. Anything that me or my team can do to help? We’re, we’re all in. It’s the listeners here. Very much deserve it so. So yeah, I’m, I’m I’m really amped. I hope to hear from from as many people as possible.

george grombacher 22:43
Love it. Well, if you enjoyed as much as I did, so grant your appreciation. Share today’s show with a friend who also appreciates good ideas. Go to livingsmith pro.com/life blood, and take advantage of Grant’s goodie bag. Download the book. Take advantage of the training. Get on a call and find out if this is the right way for you to take your next step into real estate, or even your first wherever you are. So thanks again, Grant, yeah. Thanks

Grant Shipman 23:11
so much. This is awesome Till

george grombacher 23:13
next time, remember do your part by doing your best. You.

george grombacher 16:00
So if I want my iPhone, and my Tesla and my Bitcoin to work, we need to get the metal out of the ground.

Pierre Leveille 16:07
Absolutely. Without it, we cannot do it.

george grombacher 16:13
Why? Why is there a Why has production been going down.

Pierre Leveille 16:21
Because the large mines that are producing most of the copper in the world, the grades are going down slowly they’re going there, they’re arriving near the end of life. So and of life of mines in general means less production. And in the past, at least 15 years, the exploration expenditure for copper were pretty low, because the price of copper was low. And when the price is low, companies are tending to not invest more so much in exploration, which is what we see today. It’s it’s, it’s not the way to look at it. Because nobody 15 years ago was able to predict that there would be a so massive shortage, or it’s so massive demand coming. But in the past five years, or let’s say since the since 10 years, we have seen that more and more coming. And then the by the time you react start exploring and there’s more money than then ever that is putting in put it in expression at the moment for copper at least. And what we see is that the it takes time, it could take up to 2025 years between the time you find a deposit that it gets in production. So but but the year the time is counted. So it’s it’s very important to so you will see company reopening old mines, what it will push also, which is not bad, it will force to two, it will force to find a it will force to find ways of recalibrating customer, you know the metals, that will be more and more important.

george grombacher 18:07
So finding, okay, so for lack of a better term recycling metals that are just sitting around somewhere extremely important. Yeah. And then going and going back to historic minds that maybe for lack of technology, or just lack of will or reasons, but maybe now because there’s such a demand, there’s an appetite to go back to those.

Pierre Leveille 18:33
Yes, but there will be a lot of failures into that for many reasons. But the ones that will be in that will resume mining it’s just going to be a short term temporary solution. No it’s it’s not going to be you need to find deposit that will that will operate 50 years you know at least it’s 25 to 50 years at least and an old mind that you do in production in general it’s less than 10 years.

george grombacher 19:03
Got it. Oh there we go. Up here. People are ready for your difference making tip What do you have for them

Pierre Leveille 19:14
You mean an investment or

george grombacher 19:17
whatever you’re into, you’ve got so much life experience with raising a family and doing business all over the world and having your kids go to school in Africa so a tip on copper or whatever you’re into.

Pierre Leveille 19:34
But there’s two things I like to see and I was telling my children many times and I always said you know don’t focus on what will bring you specifically money don’t think of Getting Rich. Think of doing what you what you like, what you feel your your your your your, you know you have been born to do so use your most you skills, do what you like, do what you wet well, and good things will happen to you. And I can see them grow in their life. And I can tell you that this is what happens. And sometimes you have setback like I had recently. But if we do things properly, if we do things that we like, and we liked that project, we were very passionate about that project, not only me, all my team, and if we do things properly, if we do things correctly, good things will happen. And we will probably get the project back had to go forward or we will find another big project that will be the launch of a new era. So that’s my most important tip in life. Do what you like, do it with your best scale and do it well and good things will happen.

george grombacher 20:49
Pierre Leveille 21:03
Thank you. I was happy to be with you to today.

george grombacher 21:06
Damn, tell us the websites and where where people can connect and find you.

Pierre Leveille 21:13
The it’s Deep South resources.com. So pretty simple.

george grombacher 21:18
Perfect. Well, if you enjoyed this as much as I did show up here your appreciation and share today’s show with a friend who also appreciate good ideas, go to deep south resources, calm and learn all about what they’re working on and track their progress.

Pierre Leveille 21:32
Thanks. Thanks, have a nice day.

george grombacher 21:36
And until next time, keep fighting the good fight. We’re all in this together.